Whispers Forum

DEBATE (1)
IAS or IFS both should not be allowed to join the politics, as by virtue being part of the system, more prone to corruption and misuse, manipulation. At the most these can by Governors Lt Governors vice President and President.
Harish Kumar
Fault lies in our eyes
The Fault Lies In Our Eyes, Comrades We see in others what we want to see. We criticize others for deeds outside their jurisdiction. If the police act arbitrary and unlawful and harass the common man, the prime minister can’t do much as the power of police lies with the state government. What the prime minister does is within his remit. The Indian prime minister saved millions of lives by alerting the masses in time and repeatedly holding conversation with them through his address or speeches. Had he been late, the deaths due to the mysterious fever would have provided a huge business opportunity for the jhaad-phoonk doctors, tabiz maulvis, quacks and jholachhaap doctors (all promising treatment of all kinds of diseases at almost no cost) who would have exploited the worried masses besides the comrades taking out massive rallies to blame it on the failure of the government. The wise people of India acknowledge the fact but comrades of all shades across the political spectrum try to find fault with it and sell their flawed logic. The ordinary voter in Bihar firmly acknowledged the achievement of the prime minister in saving lives when TV crews interviewed them. Only the blinkered comrades refuse to see the light of the day. Well, comrades, the fault lies in your eyes only! You should have seen Comrades the Kanyas (girl child) this Durga Ashtmi wearing masks! Narendra Modi magic?
M L Gupta

DEBATE(1)
IFS Ministers are doing good job.Both the Ministers have good national and international image.
D P Devgan
Quality of Civil Servants has gone down after 1979
With the implementation of the Kothari Commission report in the year 1979 in selection to Civil Services in the country, there is no doubt that the quality of Civil Servants has gone down considerably in this country. The result that we have in place a lot of rattu tota's (crammers) and mediocre's in the services. Many in service also do not know how to express themselves properly on files. In past it use to take a 'diya' to identify a corrupt civil servants. Those found corrupt used to be hated. For the current crop of Civil Servants you will need a 'diya' to identify a dead honest Civil Servant.
Anurag Srivastava
C-DOT in able hands
Dr. Rajkumar Upadhyay takes charge as Executive Director, C-DOT. Finally C-DOT in able hands.
Ashish

The appellant filed an application seeking information about the ODI list such as number of officers whose cases have been exonerated and date of review meeting of the ODI status of officers etc. The information was denied from disclosure under Section 8(1)(h) and 8(1)(j) of the RTI Act. The CIC observed that the disclosure of any kind of information would therefore defeat the very purpose of surveillance which is conducted through the established procedure of ODI list.
Comments
The ‘list of Public Servants of Gazetted status of Doubtful Integrity’ includes the names of those officers only who, after enquiry or during the course of enquiry, have been found to be lacking in integrity, (i) Convicted in a court of law on a charge of lack of integrity or for an offence involving moral turpitude but on whom, in view of exceptional circumstances, a penalty other than dismissal, removal or compulsory retirement is imposed; (ii) Awarded departmentally a major penalty. a) on charges of lack of integrity b) on charges of gross dereliction of duty in protecting the interests of Government although the corrupt motive may not be capable of proof; (iii) Against whom proceedings for a major penalty or a court trial are in progress for alleged acts involving lack of integrity or moral turpitude; and (iv) Who were prosecuted but acquitted on technical grounds, and in whose case on the basis of evidence during the trial there remained a reasonable suspicion against their integrity. In case of S R Senapati v. Directorate General of Income Tax (Vig.) in Second Appeal No.:- CIC/DGITV/A/2017/160016-BJ dated 16.10.2018, the CIC had directed to disclose the information applying severability.
Citation: A K Banerjee v. Chief Commissioner, CGST and Central Excise, Vadodara Zone in Second Appeal No. CIC/CCEVD/A/2018/174752, / Date of order: 01.09.2020.
Dr. Anuradha Verma (dranuradhaverma@yahoo.co.in) is an expert on RTI matters and has co-authored the books RIGHT TO INFORMATION - LAW AND PRACTICE and PIO’s guide to RTI. Apart from her weekly article here, her other articles can be read at the website of RTI Foundation of India at the link: www.rtifoundationofindia.com

DEBATE(1)
There is no comparison between a politician and an IAS administrator as a Minister. An IAS officer is used to a life of air-conditioned chambers and a hierarchical system where subordinates put up a case and he generally just signs it. He is far removed from the grass roots and has no personal knowledge of the basic problems of the country and the people. But a politician rises from grass roots or even when he/she is from a rich family. Since politicians go to the masses and meet them often. Politicians understand people's grievances better, can proudly evaluate and find answers.
S C Agrawal, Former DGP MP
Corruption in GoI - your version not true
Your version regarding corruption not in GoI is not true. Files of many corrupt officers facing CVC inquiry belongs to one particular govt sponsored ideology are pending in the Ministry specially in MO Education for the last many months. CVC has recommended action against officers but one ideology is saving them. Tender lobby is in full swing. GeM is only eye wash. Tender worth crores are provided on the instructions of Minister/Ministry.
Preeti Singh
Most difficult job
The most difficult job in 35 years carrier is to be fair, neutral and not to be attached to a post.
R K Upadhyay

DEBATE(1)
I don’t feel Ex-Civil Servants making any significant contribution in their respective Ministries. Politicians are far better.
L S Hardenia
IAS officer’s ‘Bhajan’ video a much sought after
It is rarest of rare. Unique. At the top of worldly achievement, it is really an achievement of spirituality. Great.
Raj Gopal
Anarchy in the Airwaves
While every organ of democracy has been contaminated to varied degrees in India, as also in many other advance countries, television has infected the press and lowered its prestige irrevocably. Viewers have no other option but to switch off the television rather than consume intense negativity wrapped in TV news and debates full of lies and malignant agenda. The famed “independence of the press” stands compromised today. News has become big business and filthy news becomes huge commercial success. The integrity of journalists is so low that many of them have become metaphors for corruption and doubtful integrity. The result is that the strongest Fourth Pillar has collapsed at the altar of political business, forfeiting public trust in its independence or objectivity or non-partisan reporting. Journalists can’t be blamed as no one is free or independent but subservient to his/her employer and depends on them for the job. In the early years of democracy in India, the editors used to dictate terms to the employers and were not pliable, but today they can be fired any time if they refuse to obey and do the news as demanded by the owners. There are many subjects that are included in the State List under the Constitution of India, where the executive authority vests in the state government. Police is one of them and instances are aplenty of misuse of the police in intimidating, harassing, coercing or arresting journalists for showing the spine. The free press is more or less a dead idea in democratic India. If an occasional or accidental independent and free journalist continues to be threatened and harmed, the public is bound to rebel. The people of India don’t tolerate autocratic behaviour of officers or the ministers of any rank.. Attempts to silence are going to prove counterproductive. Such conflicts regularly arise in one part or the other in India since democratic values are routinely violated by authoritative politicians and bureaucrat advisors. While the people seek justice, the political parties can ill afford to dispense justice. They are always selective. The police are not independent but function under the state government. If the police are unable to do justice to a citizen, the victim has the fundamental right to seek justice from the court. But here lies the catch: the judicial process is tardy and costly for the common man who is deterred from going to the court against the establishment.
M L Gupta

DEBATE (1)
IFS are high profile : IFS Ministers are high profile while IAS Ministers prefer to work silently.
O N Kapur
Cutoff year for spineless bureaucrat
As reported in Whispers there is a consensus that the cutoff year was 1980 and the change in recruitment pattern is responsible for this. Till 1972 the upper age limit for the IAS etc. examination (as it was then called) was 24 and candidates were allowed two attempts for each category of services – IPS, Central Services and IAS/IFS. For quite some time it was being felt that candidates from smaller towns were often unprepared for higher papers required for IAS/IFS by the age of 23 so as to be able to take two serious attempts. Hence the age was increased to 26 and the number of attempts to three. The pattern of examination remained unchanged. Then came the wave of socialism and 1979 exam (1980 batch) onwards the entire pattern was changed. Higher papers were abolished, English was deemphasised and upper age limit and number of attempts allowed went through the roof. Whether it resulted in promotion of socialism is unclear; but it resulted in a different kind of recruitment. Instead of intellectual calibre, the examination has become a test of persistence. Training was meant to inculcate ideals like service to the nation and promote esprit de corps among young persons fresh out of universities. Such a training is useless for middle aged experienced worldly-wise people. There is a wide variation between individual officers in each batch; but we are talking about the average. The responsibility for change of attitude of bureaucrats lies with the socialist-élite of the seventies and the UPSC.
M. B. Bauer
This forum is apolitical !
I am always under the opinion that this forum is apolitical one concentrating on news about bureaucracy, other govt and autonomous organisations including PSUs apart from the news about the corporate world.
K Srinivasa Rao

DEBATE (1)
IFS Ministers are methodical.
R D Paul
Selection board determines quality of batch
While agreeing to the overall assessment of Dr. Saxena I would add that even in pre 1980 batches there were glaring differences in the quality of the selected officers rather batches. In my opinion it is standard of the selection board which determines the quality of the batch e.g. 1978 and 1990 batches.
Ravinder
" Undeserved Accolades "
One Congress chatukaar called D K Barooah, in his 1974 proclamation, stooped so low as to coin the ominous slogan :
"India is Indira and Indira is India".
Barooah soon got disillusioned and left the Congress in disgust. Who is interested in recalling the horrendous days of emergency,the age of sychophancy?
Unless, lessons are learnt, history is bound to get repeated. India failed to learn lessons. Results were obvious. It is unfortunately blessed with a new breed of sychophants to fill the void and relive the horror of autocratic emergency era .
The captive TV Media and BJP’s hired chatukaars in their rhetorics take pride in equating PM Modi with India and vice-versa.
Giving credit to PM Modi for someone else's endeavours , is sinful; an open affront to indians. But, the smart public understands everything and cannot be fooled.
India is neither Modi, nor is Modi India !
India means our Armed forces, farmers, the marginalised labourers, scientists, teachers , the bureaucrats, Police etc. It also covers celebrated criminals, politicians, their sychophants like the builders mafia, dons, criminals, rapists and hooligans who can incite communal riots, violence with foreign funding, at short notice.
The moot point is : Why should credits actually due to our Armed Forces , farmers, scientists at ISRO,DRDO etc be collected as political brownie points by our Prime Minister ?
Unfair, unjust, unmerited and inequitable.
Will PM Modi stop this and eat into others’ achievements . The public gets the impression that all TV scripts are written in the PMO,focusing only on one person.
War strategies are formulated by the three army chiefs and CDS, not PM Modi. Applauding Modi for all achievements in digital and print media breeds contempt.He is shown either while praying in temples or laying foundation stones.
Let me be upfront . PM Modi must lead the Nation in these hard times. There is no substitute for him.
But he must change his style of functioning by jettisoning autocratic, obdurate and egocentric approach with an overinflated sense of self-worth.
Let him follow the consultative approach in decision making.
A K Saxena ( A former civil servant)

DEBATE (1)
In my view IAS ministers are more practical because they know the common men well.
R C Gandhi
Stop extensions
For some time it has become a routine practice to give extension to retiring bureaucrats. Are they so indispensable. These extensions would have already resulted in demoralisation of senior officers who may be next in line to occupy the coveted position. It is the rightful aspiration of every individual in any sector to occupy the highest post in their respective services. After 37 or 38 years of selfless and dedicated service, when an officer is denied his due because of such extensions, the morale of the services will suffer. The GoI should deny extensions in both state and central services unless there is requirement of retaining a few really brilliant officers for the public good.
K Srinivasa Rao
Fear of losing leadership post
Fear of losing leadership post from aspiring efficient leaders is the truth.
Bharthi

DEBATE (1)
Now the debate. As it is there is enough rivalry among several services specially the IAS and others. Why add to this. Induction of these civil servants in the cabinet itself is rather unusual. The Prime minister would have found talent in them to assign their respective portfolios to them. Some portfolios like External Affairs and Civil aviation have more visibility than Power. The number of portfolios also matters. It also depends upon the individual. Aggressiveness does not necessarily mean good performance.
Aarti Khosla
Cutoff year for spineless bureaucrat
As reported in Whispers there is a consensus that the cutoff year was 1980. This happened because UPSC changed the exam patter starting with 1979 examination (called IAS etc. examination upto 1978 exam 1979 batch). A careful observer can sense the difference between pre-1980 batches and 1980 batch. The age limit was increased as also the number of attempts. The distinction between higher and lower subjects was abolished and proficiency in English was deemphasised. In the IFS it has posed a challenge for training: How to teach Spanish, German or French to the new recruits who are not good in English. In all services, it meant loss of idealism. Middle aged people with persistence to appear in the examination again and again started entering the civil services. UPSC became Union Public Surprise Commission. There are instances of inspectors who were caught taking bribes (but acquitted being given benefit of doubt) later got into IPS and class 1 central services. The new system was meant to counter elitism in civil services; which it may have done to some extent. But the idealism that one saw in young recruits (upto 1979 batch) has been lost. Many in the pre-1980 batches became spineless and corrupt mid-career. But 1980 batch onwards, many have such tendencies while in junior scale. Journalists including MJ Akbar after meeting officer trainees have reported that for some entrants to class 1 service prime reason was to make (illicit) money. Their choice of the civil service also depended on this factor. This was not the case earlier. There is a wide variation between individual officers; but we are talking about the averages and thereby the cutoff year is rightly assessed as 1980. There have been attempts to revert to the earlier system; but such proposals are either classified as elitist and rejected or get lost in committees.
Prof. N. C. Saxena